Wicked Sharp Richardson Bros. Back Saws 12 " & 8 " Xcut & Dovetail Rip Hand Filed
Item History & Price
Vintage Richardson Back Saws
No (B.S.) Just Good Saws.Up for your consideration are 2 Richardson Bros. back saws with the improved handles or bullet nose design. Yes that's right, I said 2 which I have never done before! The 12" is the older being from around the 1880 time frame with the smaller diameter threads. The 8" is more than likely from the 1890's. The 12" is their No.5 model with apple handle, extra spring steel blade and blued back filed cross cut with a fine 14ppi. The 8"... is their No.3 model with beech handle, cast steel blade and blued back with a 14ppi rip configuration, which will make a fine, fast cutting little dovetail saw. Both have a fine set of about .003" per side, .006" total with the blade on the 12" being .023" thick and the 8" is .024". With their light set, these produce a very smooth, off the saw cut. The blades are straight on both. There's a little light pitting on the 8" with the 12" being fairly clean overall.Now the reason I'm selling two is, I didn't believe the 8" could stand on it's own. I had to take the back off because an old owner had stamped his name so deeply in the back, it affected the straightness of the it. So I removed the back, opened it up to try and correct those areas and in the process the back developed a couple cracks at the front and back. I silver brazed (high heat, not soft soldered) these after closing the back up again. Probably more work than this little saw deserved but 8" back saws are fairly uncommon and I wanted to save this little guy. It's not a looker but it's now a fully functional back saw. The 12" saw had a broken/dubbed off lower horn which I have repaired with some old apple. It's been blended in to match the old and the handle has been refinished.The blades are clean enough to see a decent reflection for that little aid that will allow you to line the blade up square for that straighter & squarer cut. Both blades were lightly cleaned & hand polished. Oh, by the way, there is a difference in machine and hand polishing. I've been in the machining world most of my life, so I know. I'm not removing any material doing it by hand. Some buffers use a hard felt wheel charged with emery, that can actually spark. Carl Bilderback had one such person that would clean saws for him and he said there were sparks. So don't let someone else bullshit you into believing there isn't a difference between hand and machine work, because there is. It's almost like saying there's no difference between hand and machine filing!The cross cut has been hand filed with my style of "UNDERCUT", which in my humble opinion, produces a very good combination of edge durability & ease of cutting. The teeth come out with no bevel on the back side which provides more support and strength to the point. This allows me to have more of a bevel on the front cutting edge, producing a smoother and faster cut with good edge retention. I'm going to use the term "UNDERCUT" for the style of filing instead of sloped. Sloped is a more recent term that Steve LaMantia came up with about 1996 on the Old Tools List to describe the Disston pictures, that most people interested in saws, have already seen. I learned of the description of "UNDERCUT" that an old Acme filer instruction booklet used, which I've added pictures of at the bottom of this description. I'm one of those filers that use more than the 4 to 5 degrees that was mentioned. You see, I'm inclined to tell the truth, it's the way I was raised, instead of adding pure bull shit to my descriptions as a marketing ploy, which the poor uninformed individual seems to gobble up on here. I've been around a while and know this information was gleaned from other knowledgeable saw guys and then claimed it as their "OWN" discovery. That my friends, is a solid FACT! If you think it's not true, look at the photos below, of private messages to me, from Woodnet.net back in 2009. Oh yeah, that would be before he learned filing a slope from Bob Smalser, later in 2009, when he actually started selling saws on eBay. Go back before 2009 and the guy was selling sun tan lotion. Bottom most pic doesn't look like much of a slope, does it! Hmmmm Filing aid lines too, all from a "Free" hander, no training wheels type of guy, that's been filing since he was around 2 years old.I truly believe my saws won't take a back seat in performance to anyone else's western style saws offered today, regardless of claims being made. I have legitimate reasons for saying this, so you can believe whomever you want on the subject, even a narcissistic, ugly, knuckle head, who picked my brain for info at one time, back when I guess I knew something. Or.....you can take the late Carl Bilderback's word (Mr. Wonderful) in the link to a great video below.I want to reiterate & stress my saws aren't just "Sharpened". I go through a lengthy process of hand tuning these saws to perform at their best. I can honestly say they are likely better than when they left the factory. All of this includes jointing, reshaping the teeth, setting, sharpening, followed by a light side dressing to bring them to a wicked sharp edge. I will guarantee this to be one of the sweetest vintage saws you can buy, period. By the way I didn't come up with the term "WICKED SHARP" it was a term given to one of my saws by a past Popular Woodworking editor and this gentleman has used quite a few different saws. I've been offering saws and sharpening for people since 2001. If you'd like to find out a little more about me just Google my name, Daryl Weir, and I'm sure you'll find enough information to satisfy yourself about my abilities.A while back, while talking to a couple of saw users, we got on the subject of the best way to get a saw started in the cut. Here's a little pointer I gave them for getting their cross cut and rip saws started. Most things you read will tell you to guide the saw with your thumb and drag the saw backward to start the kerf, which to me works like crap, especially the coarser the teeth get. Instead, lower the butt end of the saw (handle end) closer to the surface of what's being cut, guide the point end of the saw with your thumb, line up the saw with your marked line & push the saw forward to start the kerf. I'll guarentee your're going to notice right away how much easier this is. As you progress with the kerf, keep raising the butt end until you reach the angle of attack that works for you.Comeback again & Thanks for taking a look! Be sure to keep and eye out for some more nice saws coming up here in the future.Are you interested in Old Tools and Tool Collecting? Want to learn more about tools, and meet somegreat people who have the same interests? Please take a minute to check out he Mid-West Tool CollectorsWeb Site at this link: www.mwtca.org Thank You.==================================================================================
A fantastic video of Slav interviewing master carpenter, fellow M-WTCA saw collector & friend, the late Carl Bilderback. You should really watch the whole thing but if you just want to see Carl's comment on my ability to sharpen saws, go to the 28 min. mark. There's only one other person that I had more respect for than Carl, that was my father. Here's the link: Carl Bilderback video.
A recommendation below from Tom Law was one that I was really humbled by! It was on the Old Tool List back in 2009.Point of reference about Daryl Weir: When Tom Law quit sharpening, I asked Tom for a recommendation. He said the only guy he could suggest was Daryl. Bear in mind this was a number of years ago before Mike W. entered the scene, but for Tom to make this recommendation says a lot about Daryl Weir. I have never used Daryl, mainly because I used that time as an opportunity to learn to sharpen my own. Never as good as Tom Law, but better than some of the other guys who have been suggested from time to time on internet forums.Tony Z.
Daryl, I have never owned a good hand saw, but have made cuts with many, okay, hand saws. My hope was to buy one, professionally sharpened, and immediately experience the difference. Your saw did not disappoint! The first hard wood piece I could find was a scrap of poplar casing, which was no challenge. I cut a 5/4 x 8 piece of maple, and could already appreciate how fine a saw I had.As a carpenter and contractor, I look for and depend on quality tools. I now have a great hand saw.Thank you, Vance
Daryl, I got back in Germany last week, and yes - your saw was here waiting for me. Yesterday was my first day in the "shop" - and I used it for the first time.They say that a great tool in the hands of an untrained user won't make that user any better.... But, to be honest, I'm not sure that's the case. I made several cuts - and the saw cut like a hot knife through butter and tracked like a laser. I have very limited ability - but this saw turned me into a surgeon.Thank you for the work you've done - and the service that you provide to all woodworkers.In your debt, - John
"I have experience with three names mentioned in the post & replies. I highly recommend Daryl Weir and Mark at Bad Axe. Not only do they sharpen and tune saws well, they say what they mean, and do what they say. If they say it will take a week, it will take a week, not two.I have restored a lot of tools and have hired good help over the years to accomplish the work. There are some who's work was very good, however their word was not... and I waited and waited. Daryl and Mark have great work ethics, and get the work done and out the door with excellent workmanship (you will not be disappointed). Daryl and Mark are also very personable and will take the time to talk to you explaining what they will do and why.I own quite a few hand saws, I don't use most of them. My favorites I use a lot are old (a Disston backsaw, panel saw; and a Bishop backsaw) and Daryl tuned and sharpened all three of them. There is something in those old saw plates the new ones don't have, I can't explain it, but I can feel it when I cut with them.Glen Koopmans
"If you want a Saw, it is best to get one with a name on it which has a reputation. A man who has made a reputation for his goods knows its value, as well as its cost, and will maintain it." ----Henry Disston
The motto above is one that I adhere to in every saw that I refurbish. It's been a long road from where I initially started to finally get to where I am. Every saw I sell is one that I would gladly use myself.
No (B.S.) Just Good Saws.Up for your consideration are 2 Richardson Bros. back saws with the improved handles or bullet nose design. Yes that's right, I said 2 which I have never done before! The 12" is the older being from around the 1880 time frame with the smaller diameter threads. The 8" is more than likely from the 1890's. The 12" is their No.5 model with apple handle, extra spring steel blade and blued back filed cross cut with a fine 14ppi. The 8"... is their No.3 model with beech handle, cast steel blade and blued back with a 14ppi rip configuration, which will make a fine, fast cutting little dovetail saw. Both have a fine set of about .003" per side, .006" total with the blade on the 12" being .023" thick and the 8" is .024". With their light set, these produce a very smooth, off the saw cut. The blades are straight on both. There's a little light pitting on the 8" with the 12" being fairly clean overall.Now the reason I'm selling two is, I didn't believe the 8" could stand on it's own. I had to take the back off because an old owner had stamped his name so deeply in the back, it affected the straightness of the it. So I removed the back, opened it up to try and correct those areas and in the process the back developed a couple cracks at the front and back. I silver brazed (high heat, not soft soldered) these after closing the back up again. Probably more work than this little saw deserved but 8" back saws are fairly uncommon and I wanted to save this little guy. It's not a looker but it's now a fully functional back saw. The 12" saw had a broken/dubbed off lower horn which I have repaired with some old apple. It's been blended in to match the old and the handle has been refinished.The blades are clean enough to see a decent reflection for that little aid that will allow you to line the blade up square for that straighter & squarer cut. Both blades were lightly cleaned & hand polished. Oh, by the way, there is a difference in machine and hand polishing. I've been in the machining world most of my life, so I know. I'm not removing any material doing it by hand. Some buffers use a hard felt wheel charged with emery, that can actually spark. Carl Bilderback had one such person that would clean saws for him and he said there were sparks. So don't let someone else bullshit you into believing there isn't a difference between hand and machine work, because there is. It's almost like saying there's no difference between hand and machine filing!The cross cut has been hand filed with my style of "UNDERCUT", which in my humble opinion, produces a very good combination of edge durability & ease of cutting. The teeth come out with no bevel on the back side which provides more support and strength to the point. This allows me to have more of a bevel on the front cutting edge, producing a smoother and faster cut with good edge retention. I'm going to use the term "UNDERCUT" for the style of filing instead of sloped. Sloped is a more recent term that Steve LaMantia came up with about 1996 on the Old Tools List to describe the Disston pictures, that most people interested in saws, have already seen. I learned of the description of "UNDERCUT" that an old Acme filer instruction booklet used, which I've added pictures of at the bottom of this description. I'm one of those filers that use more than the 4 to 5 degrees that was mentioned. You see, I'm inclined to tell the truth, it's the way I was raised, instead of adding pure bull shit to my descriptions as a marketing ploy, which the poor uninformed individual seems to gobble up on here. I've been around a while and know this information was gleaned from other knowledgeable saw guys and then claimed it as their "OWN" discovery. That my friends, is a solid FACT! If you think it's not true, look at the photos below, of private messages to me, from Woodnet.net back in 2009. Oh yeah, that would be before he learned filing a slope from Bob Smalser, later in 2009, when he actually started selling saws on eBay. Go back before 2009 and the guy was selling sun tan lotion. Bottom most pic doesn't look like much of a slope, does it! Hmmmm Filing aid lines too, all from a "Free" hander, no training wheels type of guy, that's been filing since he was around 2 years old.I truly believe my saws won't take a back seat in performance to anyone else's western style saws offered today, regardless of claims being made. I have legitimate reasons for saying this, so you can believe whomever you want on the subject, even a narcissistic, ugly, knuckle head, who picked my brain for info at one time, back when I guess I knew something. Or.....you can take the late Carl Bilderback's word (Mr. Wonderful) in the link to a great video below.I want to reiterate & stress my saws aren't just "Sharpened". I go through a lengthy process of hand tuning these saws to perform at their best. I can honestly say they are likely better than when they left the factory. All of this includes jointing, reshaping the teeth, setting, sharpening, followed by a light side dressing to bring them to a wicked sharp edge. I will guarantee this to be one of the sweetest vintage saws you can buy, period. By the way I didn't come up with the term "WICKED SHARP" it was a term given to one of my saws by a past Popular Woodworking editor and this gentleman has used quite a few different saws. I've been offering saws and sharpening for people since 2001. If you'd like to find out a little more about me just Google my name, Daryl Weir, and I'm sure you'll find enough information to satisfy yourself about my abilities.A while back, while talking to a couple of saw users, we got on the subject of the best way to get a saw started in the cut. Here's a little pointer I gave them for getting their cross cut and rip saws started. Most things you read will tell you to guide the saw with your thumb and drag the saw backward to start the kerf, which to me works like crap, especially the coarser the teeth get. Instead, lower the butt end of the saw (handle end) closer to the surface of what's being cut, guide the point end of the saw with your thumb, line up the saw with your marked line & push the saw forward to start the kerf. I'll guarentee your're going to notice right away how much easier this is. As you progress with the kerf, keep raising the butt end until you reach the angle of attack that works for you.Comeback again & Thanks for taking a look! Be sure to keep and eye out for some more nice saws coming up here in the future.Are you interested in Old Tools and Tool Collecting? Want to learn more about tools, and meet somegreat people who have the same interests? Please take a minute to check out he Mid-West Tool CollectorsWeb Site at this link: www.mwtca.org Thank You.==================================================================================
A fantastic video of Slav interviewing master carpenter, fellow M-WTCA saw collector & friend, the late Carl Bilderback. You should really watch the whole thing but if you just want to see Carl's comment on my ability to sharpen saws, go to the 28 min. mark. There's only one other person that I had more respect for than Carl, that was my father. Here's the link: Carl Bilderback video.
A recommendation below from Tom Law was one that I was really humbled by! It was on the Old Tool List back in 2009.Point of reference about Daryl Weir: When Tom Law quit sharpening, I asked Tom for a recommendation. He said the only guy he could suggest was Daryl. Bear in mind this was a number of years ago before Mike W. entered the scene, but for Tom to make this recommendation says a lot about Daryl Weir. I have never used Daryl, mainly because I used that time as an opportunity to learn to sharpen my own. Never as good as Tom Law, but better than some of the other guys who have been suggested from time to time on internet forums.Tony Z.
Daryl, I have never owned a good hand saw, but have made cuts with many, okay, hand saws. My hope was to buy one, professionally sharpened, and immediately experience the difference. Your saw did not disappoint! The first hard wood piece I could find was a scrap of poplar casing, which was no challenge. I cut a 5/4 x 8 piece of maple, and could already appreciate how fine a saw I had.As a carpenter and contractor, I look for and depend on quality tools. I now have a great hand saw.Thank you, Vance
Daryl, I got back in Germany last week, and yes - your saw was here waiting for me. Yesterday was my first day in the "shop" - and I used it for the first time.They say that a great tool in the hands of an untrained user won't make that user any better.... But, to be honest, I'm not sure that's the case. I made several cuts - and the saw cut like a hot knife through butter and tracked like a laser. I have very limited ability - but this saw turned me into a surgeon.Thank you for the work you've done - and the service that you provide to all woodworkers.In your debt, - John
"I have experience with three names mentioned in the post & replies. I highly recommend Daryl Weir and Mark at Bad Axe. Not only do they sharpen and tune saws well, they say what they mean, and do what they say. If they say it will take a week, it will take a week, not two.I have restored a lot of tools and have hired good help over the years to accomplish the work. There are some who's work was very good, however their word was not... and I waited and waited. Daryl and Mark have great work ethics, and get the work done and out the door with excellent workmanship (you will not be disappointed). Daryl and Mark are also very personable and will take the time to talk to you explaining what they will do and why.I own quite a few hand saws, I don't use most of them. My favorites I use a lot are old (a Disston backsaw, panel saw; and a Bishop backsaw) and Daryl tuned and sharpened all three of them. There is something in those old saw plates the new ones don't have, I can't explain it, but I can feel it when I cut with them.Glen Koopmans
"If you want a Saw, it is best to get one with a name on it which has a reputation. A man who has made a reputation for his goods knows its value, as well as its cost, and will maintain it." ----Henry Disston
The motto above is one that I adhere to in every saw that I refurbish. It's been a long road from where I initially started to finally get to where I am. Every saw I sell is one that I would gladly use myself.
